BRITS, AMERICANS AND JEWS..
Saturday, November 29, 2008 at 10:39AM 
I am sure that you, like me, have been sickened by the appalling terrorist acts carried out by Jihadists in Bombay. With almost 150 dead, the scale of the horror is hard to take in. So has the almost casual barbarism of those who carried out the acts of terror. It appears that the killers were on the look out for anyone with a US/UK passport to slaughter. Similarly, the chance to kill some Jews was just too good to pass up on and so ...
Six Jewish hostages had been murdered in Bombay. Rabbi Levi Shemtov, the director of American Friends of Lubavitch, said that two of the dead were Rabbi Gavriel Holtzberg and his wife, Rivka, who directed the Chabad House. Rabbi Holtzberg was a dual US - Israel citizen; Rivka was Israeli. The identities of the other three Israelis were not released. Earlier, a cook from Chabad House fled to safety with the Holtzbergs' 2-year-old son, Moshe. The boy’s pants were soaked in blood when he emerged.
Two years old. Soaked with blood - and his family is now dead. My god - what can you say other than to swear that the Islamist scum behind this, those that planned it and those who secretly cheer at the slaughter will never prevail. It is 9/11 days we live in and these are 9/11 killers.
India 
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Reader Comments (73)
I refer to my comment of yesterday " I look forward to the day when the homelands of the ROP are interconnecting craters of radioactive slag. " . I do not believe that I have anything to add to that .
The Doctor and British Barry must make you proud, David.
The whole thing is plain cruelty imposed by a sick group. The only part I don't understand is why terrorists were captured alive. They should have been shot dead in the street.
'Similarly, the chance to kill some Jews was just too good to pass up on and so ...'
So why didn't they shoot them as soon as they got hold of them? Why wait until the place was being stormed by 'special' forces?
Also i'd hazard a guess and say a few muslims and hindus died in the attacks as well. Don't they deserve a mention David?
Mahons,
Exactly. They deserve death.
'They should have been shot dead in the street.'
'Exactly. They deserve death.'
Yeah, who cares about whatever valuable intel the captured terrorists might be able to provide. Laughable stuff.
RS - such as that they were terrorists? I think that information was leaked already.
Fuck Islam. This is the final straw.
Right Mahons, who cares where they were trained, how they were financed or who the men behind the scenes are. All we need to know is 'that they were terrorists'.
Well done.
Mahons -
Not yet. Thankfully one has been captured alive and the intelligence will be priceless.
I don't care what persuasive measures the Indians use either. I really don't care. If the usual suspects want to argue about it after, they can go right ahead.
Then they can put a 9mm in the back of his head.
-------
I mentioned in here a few weeks ago why I have an Irish passport, saying something like when I'm on a hijacked ship and the ragheads single out the Britons, Americans and Israelis, I'll be waving that Irish passport at them.
No, I'll leave the magnificent and futile gesture to Johnny Frog who does it best. He can leap onto the barricade with a cri de coeur on his lips just before being torn apart in a hail of bullets.
I'll stay alive and watch the fuzzy wuzzies die. I'll even help out if I can.
However, the lesson is clear - the chances of being attacked by terrorists is tiny, but if you can get your mits on a safe, neutral chit, then do so.
RS - indeed, I care not how they were trained. The acts are fairly low tech (attack civilians with rifles and automatic weapons). These were not a group of rocket scientists.
How they were financed frankly is probably unknown to the low level creatures who committed the attack, and probably can be traced as easily with them dead as alive.
Who sent them can likely be ascertained without their cooperation, especially since an attack of this scale has conspirators who were engaged in other parts.
We give them too much credit by assigning to themtoo much sophistication. They should have been all shot dead in the street as a punishment and as a warning.
Pete - I won't get an Irish passport for that very reason.
As for the imtelligence to be gained from the street level thugs who committed the attacks, I don't know. Maybe I'll reconsider, but I have grave doubts that it would be priceless or is unavailable elsewhere.
"Yeah, who cares about whatever valuable intel the captured terrorists might be able to provide. Laughable stuff."
What's laughable is that one of ATW's chief Lefties who constantly whines on about the horrors of Guantanamo Bay and how terrible it would be to use anything but verbal interrogation on terror suspects who says they should be taken alive to produce intel. And when they say 'we dont feel like talking thanks' obviously it should then be a cup of tea and a biscuit...
These scum aren't 'suspects'. It's the guns in their hands that give it away.
Mahons -
We'll see, but it's my sense that the attack was well planned and carried out and something above the street thug level.
The Indian military is reporting (via Sky News) that their commandos were matched in the Taj Hotel, hence why the commandos were held off for three days by a handful of terrorists.
This suggests the terrorists didn't just have 6 week's training in a mountain camp somewhere.
Of course, the Indian military might be embarrassed at being held up for so long and are talking up the opposition. But we'll see.
DSD - Your inability to grasp certain basic concepts is a disease without cure. Terrorists actively gunning down civilians in one's streets are quite a different animal than people who may or may not actually have committed any terrorist act and who are rounded up thousands of miles away and taken to a remote location where they are held indefintely.
Pete - I suppose it may be too early to tell, and of course there are elements in the Pakistan military and intelligence services who support Islamic radicals.
DSD - I reread your comment, and I now see where you were directing your point. Appears the disease rests with me, my apologies.
but what are the roooooooot causes !?
DSD those who criticise Guantanamo Bay, should also be appalled at the judge, jury and executioner mindset displayed here in respect of what should be done to those suspects taken alive. Those who advocate the immediate shooting of them, cannot then with a straight face condemn the bay. What is laughable is certain peoples inconsistency.
What's laughable is that one of ATW's chief Lefties who constantly whines on about the horrors of Guantanamo Bay and how terrible it would be to use anything but verbal interrogation on terror suspects who says they should be taken alive to produce intel.
The difference being that a terrorist blatantly caught in the act is likely to be of value to the intelligence community. Most people can also accept that there are likely similar people in Gitmo. Its the myriad examples of imprisoned innocents and evidence of torture that are condemned.
Those who advocate the immediate shooting of them, cannot then with a straight face condemn the bay. What is laughable is certain peoples inconsistency.
RS, my thoughts exactly.
there is no evedence of torture from gitmo.
Mahons has inadvertainly put up the justification of an attitude that is gaining more and more support in the American military.
Take no prisoners When any prisoner that is taken is treated as a petty criminal and is granted rughts under the american constitution like they were an american citisen caught stealing at a k-mart then the only choice is to kill them on the battle field.
Tons of intelligence can be gleaned from the dead more than you can get from some butcher with an aclu lawyer.
I have an Irish passport, for a number of reasons. The most important being that I just like the connection. There are practical reasons, however.
I may choose to live in Ireland or elsewhere in the EU someday. Its unlikely, but its not impossible. With this paperwork done, I would have the legal right to move in next week if I so chose-there would be no need for any work visa.
The second is that I do travel to Europe often enough, and many of the international airports have separate fast moving lines for EU Passport holders and slower lines for those from outside the EU. I like having the option of taking the very fast line. ( which allows me to amaze business fellow travelers who don't know how I accomplish this feat )
But the third is that the Mumbai situation - where Americans and Brits and Jews were singled out - was not exactly unforseen. By me, and undoubtedly many here. Even 20 years ago, I discussed this possibility, about a hijacked plane when Americans and others were singled out.
I've traveled far and wide, and there are many counties I've yet to see. It may surprise some here, but some of the countries I want to see include Egypt, Jordan, Lebanon, maybe Syria. When I go there, I will bring the two passports, and will keep them in a hidden place. You never know.
---
The fact that Jews were targeted and killed in Mumbai simply for being Jews has not gone unnoticed in Israel. At a time of their choosing, there will be a muscular reaction by the Mossad. The long arm of the law will reach anywhere it needs to, including any part of Pakistan.. I wish them godspeed.
I would not have such a choice, even if the propaganda were true that they are trying to make Mexico, Canada and the US one nation I would not change my passport.
I would if in that type of situation I'm sure be killed. Knowing that the odds are that I would die anyway given any opportunity I would attack a terrorist. The end result maybe the same but I will die Fighting.
Pete Moore.
The reason the Indian special forces took so long was because this was not the Iranian embassy with a dozen or so rooms. This place had hundreds.
There seems to be a lot of diplomatic maneuvering between here and India right now, and the UK police are out there already, which suggests there is a UK/terrorist link.
It would be likely too, because the terrorists were asking for UK/USA citizens, so they would have to be able to speak and read English, esp credit cards.(passports are handed in at initial reception for safe keeping)
I would'nt mind betting the Indian police were under instructions to kill all of them, (they usually commit suicide before capture, anyway) so to lessen the tension as to where they came from; at least until things cool off for a few days/weeks until DNA is collected.
Actually there is a difference between a terrorist caught in the midst of the actual act for all to see and someone picked up and transported thousands of miles based on a mere allegation.
It is no small distinction.
Troll
The most effective way to fight may well be to lay low until the right time. If you choose to make your stand while the bastard has a gun pointed at you, as he asks for your passport, your chance of providing an effective resistance are - zero. You won't have the chance to go down fighting. You'll go down while intending to fight. Big difference.
--
Even the US in a sense agrees with my position- if you are a repeat traveler to both Israel and the Arab world, you can get two US passports. The first that the Israelis can stamp, the second, which will not be stamped by Israel, and which can be used to travel to Syria, Lebanon, Dubai and other places that boycott Israel.
Pete"I mentioned in here a few weeks ago why I have an Irish passport, saying something like when I'm on a hijacked ship and the ragheads single out the Britons, Americans and Israelis, I'll be waving that Irish passport at them.
No, I'll leave the magnificent and futile gesture to Johnny Frog who does it best. He can leap onto the barricade with a cri de coeur on his lips just before being torn apart in a hail of bullets.
I'll stay alive and watch the fuzzy wuzzies die. I'll even help out if I can."
Hey Pete, you will help out after the work is done, you have crawled out of the hole you crawled into while there was any danger and you have put your Irish passport back in your pocket? LOL
Phantom **But the third is that the Mumbai situation - where Americans and Brits and Jews were singled out - was not exactly unforseen. By me, and undoubtedly many here. Even 20 years ago, I discussed this possibility, about a hijacked plane when Americans and others were singled out.**
Such Bravado I have never seen LOL.
And then comes along Troll from the safety of his house: "I would not have such a choice, even if the propaganda were true that they are trying to make Mexico, Canada and the US one nation I would not change my passport.
I would if in that type of situation I'm sure be killed. Knowing that the odds are that I would die anyway given any opportunity I would attack a terrorist. The end result maybe the same but I will die Fighting.
"
Goodness, such bravado. LOL
I didn't say I wouldn't try to choose the right moment
Pinky unlike you some of us do have a set! Like passengers of flight 93
.....I have to agree with others here; For David Vance to single out six Orthodox Jews for selective sympathy, as against the other 100+ dead, strikes me as clumsy at best, and 'special pleading' at worst.
Troll
If you're first asked to provide a passport, you may never get the chance to wait until the right moment.
Pinky
There's no bravado from here, not on this thread anyway. Having two passports can be seen as a lack of bravado.
But since you asked, I hope and expect that I would have joined Todd Beamer and the other brave passengers on that flight.
Bernard
The Jews were singled out for reasons of religion and were the only ones singled out for that reason by the Muslim terrorists. That is worthy of mention.
But since you asked, I hope and expect that I would have joined Todd Beamer and the other brave passengers on that flight.
Of course you would Phantom. Of course you would.
Pinky -
Shouting defiance with an AK47 at you is stupid. I can assure you that I'd slit a terrorist's throat with a bread knife while he's distracted later on.
Now Phantom and I don't impress you, not that we were attempting to do so. Troll sitting in his house doesn't impress you with the other approach.
Do you have anything interesting to say madam?
Pinky unlike you some of us do have a set! Like passengers of flight 93
Yes, sure you are Troll, sure you are.
If you choose to make your stand while the bastard has a gun pointed at you, as he asks for your passport, your chance of providing an effective resistance are - zero
I'd suggest the chances of Troll behaving in the heroic way he describes are... zero! Troll's been reading too many of his Batman comics methinks.
Goodness, such bravado. LOL
I know Pinky. I've laughed a lot at this tread. Thanks folks, and good night!
Pete some would choose to submit and die others would choose to fight and die.
We all know which group pinky falls into
'Shouting defiance with an AK47 at you is stupid. I can assure you that I'd slit a terrorist's throat with a bread knife while he's distracted later on.
Now Phantom and I don't impress you, not that we were attempting to do so. Troll sitting in his house doesn't impress you with the other approach.
Do you have anything interesting to say madam?'
Well maybe not, but I do have a question.
Why are you not brave enough to match word with deed? Why do you hide your nationality, when YOU of all people decry the demise of British pride, and patriotism?
DC it is not heroics it is a choice, just as I chose to serve my country in the military.
It is how you are raised
Ever been to war, Troll?
I know Pinky. I've laughed a lot at this tread. Thanks folks, and good night!
LOl I know, it has been a sight to behold, and look at poor Pete lose the bap!
Now, I'll be off to read me Beano and hide under the bed with me passport. THEN, I'll take out the terrorists!
Bernard -
Yes, it's a big old hotel, but there weren't that many terrorists and it took four days.
Now don't get me wrong. I am absolutely not sitting here at home with my passport collection having a dig at men who went into the place not knowing if they'd survive.
What I mean is that the Indian military has said that the terrorists matched the commandos for skill. Either this means that we're not talking street thug dupes, or someone in the military is getting their interpretation out first.
Anything could lie behind such a motivation. Maybe an unthinking government minister told the CO to get a move on, prompting the CO to go to the media.
It's at times like these, behind the headlines, careers are being made and broken. Human relations being what they are, some see this aftermath as an opportunity move up in their world.
There's a reason why the Indian military have talked up the terrorists, maybe we'll never know the truth of it.
LOL Pinky!!
Love this classic from Pete 'Big Tough Man' Moore:
"I can assure you that I'd slit a terrorist's throat with a bread knife while he's distracted later on"
Yes, after you've thrown all the children to the front and crawled, weeping, into your suitcase! :)
Deception is too valuable a tool to be left to Muslims.
If they can practice Al-taqiyya,I will act as I see fit, according to the circumstances.
Sure you will, Phantom!
DC I served during the Reagan period was I in true battle no. Have I ever been shot at? Yes
In military life and in civilian life. Was I scared? Of course.
"""I can assure you that I'd slit a terrorist's throat with a bread knife while he's distracted later on"
Yes, after you've thrown all the children to the front and crawled, weeping, into your suitcase! :)""
Don't drop that Irish passport!
LOL
Pinky -
Don't be silly. I've explained why I have an Irish passport and the circumstances in which I'd wave it high.
Now when you want a man to put an arm around your dainty litle shoulders and reassure you, it would help that he's alive, handsome and thinking.
The bloke on the deck with a hole is his chest won't be much use.
Have I ever been shot at? Yes
Monica doesn't count.
""Pinky -
Don't be silly. I've explained why I have an Irish passport and the circumstances in which I'd wave it high.
Now when you want a man to put an arm around your dainty litle shoulders and reassure you, it would help that he's alive, handsome and thinking.
The bloke on the deck with a hole is his chest won't be much use.""
yes you have explained that you LOVE being British so much, that you carry an IRISH passport just in case you run into a terrorist.
I think it might be me reassuring you Pete, as I have never done such a dastardly thing in my life. I might even lend you me pink cardigan to settle your shakes.