Perhaps these three unrepentant murders should be locked in a room with Dr Rowan Williams the Archdhimmi of Canterbury so as he can explain how Christianity is the real culprit behind the Bali bombings and then he should offer his admission to Indonesia's President and receive a pardon.

I'm sure the avowed Islamic terrorists would be chastened by the good Bishops intervention and show their appreciation by administering a jab of Novocaine before applying a sharp knife to his holiness's throat.

We are for capital punishment in this case?

Monica - Yes. I am opposed to capital punishment for common criminal murder, but see it as necessary for a terrorist act that results in murder and certain categories of treason. I probably could be talked into supporting it for the intentional murder of a law enforement officer in the line of duty or a corrections officer in the line of duty as well.

You might or might not recall that I believe the common criminal murderer deserving of death, but I have a lack of faith in the system to insure that convictions in those cases are foolproof, and I am concerned that an innocent person might be but to death. In the categories I mention above, there is less chance for error and greater need to deter.

Eddie - caution, someone may fault you for always boxing the bishop (I am told it leads to blindness).

How on earth is there less chance for error versus the case you posted on yesterday. Or say the Levi Bellfield here or the Wests?

You will have no doubt read that Spanish courts have today repealed guily verdicts for a number of the previously convicted terrorists over the Madrid bombings.

Your arguments do not make sense Mahons.

Alison - It is like degrees of murder. We recognize the difference between manslaughter (someone drunk behind the wheel of a car running over a pedestrian) and first degree murder (soemone planning the murder of another ).

Capital offenses (those warranting death) are of a kind that the state's need to protect itself and its citizens are of an even higher degree than the ordinary murder. Thus the exceptions to my oppostion to the death penalty that I would make for terrorist attacks resulting in murder, certain acts of treason etc.

The level of investigation, the level of prosecution and the level of the trial involved in such major capital cases is far greater than the ordinary murder trial. Hence my belief that they have a far less likely chance of error.

There executions are therefore likely to take place shortly. Sadly, no tickets are available for the good seats.

It will be a day of official mourning throughout the jihad dominions then. Pakistan, Gaza, Lebanon, Iran... Dontcha just feel for those folks?

Spain proves otherwise apparently. I don't think you can make such a statement unequivocably regards terror and murder trials at all. It can be very clear when someone is prosecuted for murder that there is no room for error, subject to the body of evidence involved. If you are satisfied to see them banged up for life you are satisfied of their guilt in any case. And the risk exists that you will get any case wrong, terrorist, serial rapist, murderer. The public have equal right to justice, deterrant and protection from all such monsters.

Indonesia has historically been very lenient on Islamist terrorists, so it wouldn't surprise me if something prevents them from being executed, whether an 'escape' or a pardon or something else.

The thing is a life sentence for a wrongly convicted person can at least be overturned. A death sentence for a wrongfully convicted person obviously can not be overturned (or at least if overturned it does the wrongfully convicted person little good), which is why I would limit the ultimate punishment to the ultimate crimes only.

Mahons,

You see the death penalty as the ultimate punishment for these heartless men. I wonder if they share this view. After all, death would mean martyrdom to such misguided idiots—a good outcome.

Life imprisonment on the other hand would mean that they suffer hourly, daily for their horrible crime. Plus, they MAY be innocent (though it's highly unlikely). So everyone wins, even those like me who are against capital punishment.

Dawkins - They acknowledged their crimes and attempted to justify them so I don't understand the claim that they may be innocent.

I don't mind the martyr complex, let them believe it if they want to.

Good decision, get the rope!!

I am liking this side of you Mahons.

First of all, I disagree with any State sanctioned murder. Executing these people will lower the sate to the same level of savage as the people who carried out the bombing in Bali.

Secondly, martyring these three men will cause the deaths of more people than those who died in the Bali bombing. It would be a larger punishment to turn them into cheap slave labour for the rest of their natural lives.

Might just postpone that return to Bali I was thinking about.

Seamus........liberal. ;-)

The Pope is against the Death Penalty. Hands up who wants to call him a liberal and not get laughed at. :)

The pope is not natural and I will not order my thoughts from his silly churchified pronouncements.

I love poking at your soft spot Seamus. :-)
No hard feelings.

Actually the Pope is quite liberal on some things and quite conservative on others. It is fun to drive everyone crazy. Maybe they'll make me Pope since I do the same (of course they would have to waive the marriage thing, the living in Rome thing and the hats. I get bad enough hat hair from my baseball cap).

You floored a few people here today Mahons. Very cool!

I love my religion. But the Pope stuff is a little........I need to be quiet now before Jesus zaps me.

Daphne - I am a centrist often accused here of being a liberal, so when I roll right God help the unwashed commie pinko bedwetting tennis wimps!

Don't let the Pope get in the way, I am sure God doesn't. He's our Queen (note his Prada shoes).

Now Mahons, we both know that the only thing similar between the Queen and the Pope is that they both want us to forget that they are German.

You're going straight to hell now Mahons. The popes shoe's are so off limits!

You can't even see his shoes, he wears a long dress.

Seamus - That is the second time you've hit a home run in as many days (both German - wait until Alison gets her claws n you for that). Well played sir.

Daphne: I was already on my way there.

We'll share a beer someday Mahons.

Seamus is good!

Thank you, I'll be here all week. Try the fish and be sure to tip your waitress.

I'm not afraid of Alison. Possible afraid of AC, but not Alison.

Alison is cool, just passionate.

Daphne: Not just one, several.

But she can't deny that someone called Elizabeth Saxe-Coburg-Gotha isn't German. :)

Um, yes she does. The "Windsors" are the only immigrants most ATW righties can abide.

That would be the funniest fucking thing if they deported the Royals back to Germany or Greece. None of them have jobs. They pay taxes. Bunch of useless spongers. I'm surprised the right can stand them.

shuuuut upppp Seamus. Holy crap, I'm trying to get ac off your ass. Making Alison angry brings out the beast in her boyfriend.

Alison could explode planets when peeved. :-)

She's really sweet on the inside though, I like her way too much.

Mahons - we're killing a case buddy and it won't be Bud.

*Oops, that should say "They don't pay taxes". Don't tell me Alison is a Royalist. Don't worry about Daphne, I'll play nice.