Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan, A Disloyal American?
Saturday, November 7, 2009 at 02:56AM New Jersey's Kareem Khan was only 14 on September 11, 20O1. He had to wait until 2007, when he was twenty, to die in the service of his country in Iraq as a member of the 2nd Infantry Division. He was awarded the Purple Heart, a Bronze Star, and is buried in Arlington National Cemetery.
He happened to be Muslim, like thousands of others who have served their country with honor.
One can recognize the real dangers of radical Islamic terrorists without having to resort to slandering an entire people. I don't recall too many of the armchair warriors of ATW taking a leave of absence from blogging to serve in the wars they advocate, do you? Corporal Khan made the supreme sacrifice, and among the things he died for was the freedom of speech for those who would use it to label him disloyal based merely upon his religious beliefs. Perhaps, if they had the capacity to reflect upon his sacrifice, they would be less quick to sterotype all Muslims.
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Reader Comments (78)
How many people does it take to make a terrorist?? ONE. All it takes is ONE person to commit terror on his fellow man. Now when someone yells out "Allah Akbar" as he is gunning down innocent people on an army base no less, well call me simple, but that's an Islamic terrorist in my book. Does that mean I am going to tar my good friend Assali ( who is a devout Muslim) with the same brush as the shooter Major Hassan? No, that would make absolutely no sense.
But this stupid business of not calling a spade a spade, is getting ridiculous. The guy was a MUSLIM. He shot a bunch of people in the name of Allah. There are PRECEDENTS in our recent history that makes this point quite relevant. And to not speak it out loud is as irresponsible, and ignorant as your charge of others slandering all Muslims as terrorists.
Very fair comment Mahons.
I would tend to go along with the Jihad theory on the Fort Hood shooting, but this is not to negate the honor and loyalty of Khan in any way.
In any case, investigations like this take a lot of time, and unusually the perpetrator survived, which (1) means he can be interviewed - rather than just pure speculation and (2) he does of course have a right to due process, but IMHO if found guilty should face the full rigours of the law right up to capital punishment if that is decided.
Dhimmi.
>>One can recognize the real dangers of radical Islamic terrorists without having to resort to slandering an entire people. I don't recall too many of the armchair warriors of ATW taking a leave of absence from blogging to serve in the wars they advocate,<<
LOL, Very well said !
"Shooting raises fears for sanity of entire Western World"
(Mark Steyn).
http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=NjlhMTk3YjhiMWNiNTE0OTBmOTc1ZjQ4MzM0MjFlMWQ=
Get him.
Pete
You can't argue against Mahon's accurate posting above can you ?
Colm -
You can argue with it of course, but I wasn't. Instead I was raising an imagimary handbag and making an "oooooh" sound.
I'll argue with it now if you like. Those who urge others to "to reflect upon his sacrifice", all the the better to "be less quick to sterotype all Muslims" ought to reflect themselves on the fact that no-one has stereotyped all muslims in here.
They ought to reflect also on whether Hasan's parents - immigrants from the West Bank - were the beneficiaries of instruments such as Ted Kennedy's Immigration Act. If so - if so - they can reflect on the deliberate slurring of conservatives and patriots who opposed him and whether thirteen corpses is a price worth paying for liberals to feel good about themselves.
They can reflect also on the pertinence of the case being yet another muslim mass murderer committing mass murder in the name of islam and that others won't be deflected from it with diversionary arguments.
Pete
I know you were doing your Dick Emery impersonation. Or are you one of those 'ladies' in the Kitchen towel ads :)
Anyway, back on topic. There are plenty of comments on posts here which have stereotyped ALL Muslims. "You can't trust any of them, get rid of all of them. They are all loyal to Allah and enemies of non-muslims and will kill us all given half the chance None of them should be allowed to serve in the military etc etc... you will find such sentiments posted on many threads here on ATW . Your comment about 13 corpses being the price of liberalism is absurd. The US has around 4 - 5 million Muslims. It also many states has some of the most lax gun laws in the world . How many of those American Muslims have taken the opportunity to carry out mass murder sprees on 'infidels'. ?
I am not blind to the obvious problems in the modern world with the degree of murderous behaviour carried out in the name of Islam and condoned by significant swathes of that religion and I do not pretend that such evil is equally present in Christianity or other religions, it is not and it is not 'Islamaphobic' to acknowledge that, but the vast majority of Muslims are quiet ordinary people leading rather uneventful lives and have as much desire to become murder/martyrs in the name of their faith as you or I do and should not be tainted by the actions of murderous terrorists who use Islam as an excuse for their bloodlust.
Excellent stuff Pete Moore
His famiy has expressed their horror at what he did. As immigrants they happen to share that status with at least one of the service victims, who is a native of Columbia. In fact at least three of the service victims were women, and one male service member Asian-American. Not the demographics generally hailed by the far right here, but quite natural to us Yanks. And the shooter was apparently taken down by a female civilian police officer. Her choice of weapon, a service revolver, contrasts favoraby with Pete Moore's choice of a handbag.
Colm -
Well it's not stereotyping anyone to want rid of an obviously alien and dangerous threat to our Christian civilisation.
By the way, how many islamic attacks must there be for them to have taken our stereotype and lived up to it?
We can also start asking what part liberal sensibilities about profiling and race had in allowing this known and tracked (bravo, government) muslim to remain known and tracked until he committed mass murder.
That he, let's say, celebrated the diversity of his religion by calling for infidels to be beheaded and for muslims to rise up against the invader, is known.
Yet, not only was he never picked up, not only was he allowed to remain in uniform, he was slated for deployment.
Are we allowed to ask why? Or would that be offensive?
There is a clear distinction to be made between the failure to properly access Hasan's instability and your need to label all Muslims as disloyal.
The koran does that.
Sgt. John Russell shot and killed five of his felow US servicemen in Iraq last spring. I am certainly not going to blame all Christians for that.
In order to combat radical Islam we have to be able to make distictions between the bad guys and the good.
Pete
I don't disagree with most of your 11.44am. Religious sensitivities or 'diversity policy' should never be allowed to undermine security. Islamic terrorism will be defeated by isolating and destroying Islamic terrorists, not by tentatively lumping all Muslims by association in the same camp. There are just too many Muslims in the world to make enemies of them all. I cherish our moderate liberal Christian based culture where belief does not impose itself on wider society through force of law and appreciate the damage such concepts as Sharia and politicised Islamic intolerance can do to it and we should always be firm in saying to Muslim activists or indeed any other religious group that they are free to practise their beliefs but we will not censor or amend our freedoms in any way to impose their sensitivities on others.
Obviously all Muslim soldiers should not be tarred by the same brush because of what Hassan did, but it is slightly ridiculous that the first reaction in many quarters to a massacre by an Islamist is to worry about the potential backlash against muslims, despite the fact that after previous such incidents there has been little or no such backlash.
A classic example to my mind was after the London Tube bombings one police force decided to issue its officers with green ribbons to express solidarity with Muslims.
Colm -
The moderate, liberal Christian based culture you cherish is a legacy of what our peope did. You cannot replace the population with aliens and hold on to what went before.
That Christian based culture did not just happen - it is unique to our islands because we are a unique people with a unique history and traditions.
Already a few decades of Leftist-driven mass immigration has brought our walk through the ages to an end. Our liberties have been destroyed because of immigration. The right to speak absolutely freely was a result of that moderate, liberal, Christian based culture but and now it's gone. It's gone because immigration was the pretext for you and me to me made less free.
Well I'm in no mood to take lectures from the Left or anywhere else on moderation and being nice. These are people who are welcome to apologise and then STFU for the deliberate damage their political ideology has wrought.
Look, the last remnants of that Christian based culture will be extinguished, guaranteed, if we're all obliging the Left and their extreme, anti-British, anti-liberty, cancerous dogma by pretending that the most important thing is to be nice to muslims. No, we can tell muslims to STFU too and sling their hooks if they don't like it.
That's the straight choice. We can all be nice and cuddly and let any alien in, but we'll be doing it until the black flag of islam flies high above our descendents.
Well fuck that.
"The Massacre"
http://www.amnation.com/vfr/#014684
Fuck that, indeed
Pete
Our walk through the ages is not at an end and it will not come to an end - barring Armageddon. Society changes, it always has and it always will. There have always been cultural or social and legal restrictions on the utterances of various viewpoints. It is not true to say that we once could say whatever we liked. Free speech is a concept which changes with the times. Yes, 100 years ago a Briton could utter racist comments with little affect , comments which would get him into trouble today but on the other hand that same Briton would have experienced far less tolerance if he had 'come out' as homosexual or if she had condemned an intolerable marraige and insisted on divorcing her husband and living as a single woman. Indeed if people expressed other liberal views on sexuality or decried Christianity or the monarchy they would have faced greater opprobium than they would today. We have never had a genuinely free society. However, yes we should be ever vigilant in protecting our comparatively free and liberal culture and insist that all newcomers here adopt our level of tolerance and liberty and never bend it to suit that which they had been used to in their home cultures but it is defeatist to claim that our traditions have gone and we have been defeated by the 'multicultural marxists' . There's a lot of life in the old bulldog yet :)
Mahon
Excellent post
not even spoiled by this "I don't recall too many of the armchair warriors of ATW taking a leave of absence from blogging to serve in the wars they advocate, do you"
Totally irrelevant and detracts from your main point.
RIP Kareem Khan.
I salute you!
"Are we allowed to ask why?"
So far, but our time frame is shrinking. We've jumped through the looking-glass as a society. It wasn't Husan who was disloyal Pete, It's us, for asking questions.
Never have I blamed all Muslims, ever, never. I do question this Muslim and his version of radicalism.
BTW, I passed on the well wishes of ATW from David and others to one serviceman wounded in the attack. When I told him that 'Many in Britian stand with us" he got this big sheepish grin on his face, and then his officer escorts started smiling as well! A tiny good moment in the maelstrom.
I disagree, Aileen. Mahons' point was well made. There have been too many comments here trying to drag the whole Muslim community into the range of the - very justified - anger at these latest killings. It was, for example, said here not only that Muslims are not loyal to their countries, but that because of their religion they cannot even be loyal to the armies they serve in and even that they should all be kicked out.
It is more than justified to point out the hypocrisy of those here who deny the loyalty of Muslims fighting for western countries - even after they were killed proving it - while they themselves refuse to fight the wars they claim they believe in and that Muslims don't.
Charles
"BTW, I passed on the well wishes of ATW from David and others to one serviceman wounded in the attack. When I told him that 'Many in Britian stand with us" he got this big sheepish grin on his face, and then his officer escorts started smiling as well! A tiny good moment in the maelstrom."
One of the advantages of the internet :o)
I knew there had to be another advantage to the net apart from porn ;)
Aileen
Good posting
How the heck does Mahons know what we armchair warriors do annyway?
'immigrants from the West Bank'
Just spent a week in the West Bank, lovely people, humble and welcoming in the face of such adversity.
'ought to reflect themselves on the fact that no-one has stereotyped all muslims in here.'
You sure Pete?
'The koran does that.'
Hmmmmmmmm
Aileen - as the jewel in the crown of ATW and all around good egg I always take your comments with a higher degree of seriousness than I do others. In so doing, I will have to respectfully agree to disagree with you as to the armchair warrior comment, which was the jewel in the crown of the post.
Charles - I was particularly touched by the wide range of lives lost among the victims, ages 19-62, a grandmother, a pregnant woman, a bomb dismantler, a psychiatrist, and combat veterans. Most heartbreaking. I also pray for the wounded victims, including the police officer who helped bring him down and was apparently shot in the head. Such a waste of life.
Just spent a week in the West Bank
I'll bet you did!
Party time!
Phantom, I care not a jot what you believe.
Had a lovely stay at the Bethlehem Star Hotel, visted Hebron, Nablus, Ramallah, and several small villages such as B'ilin who are affected by the apartheid wall, not to mention the disgusting treatment visible in East Jerusalem.
How was the sermon Friday night?
What sermon would that be Phantom?
The one at the mosque
Only mosque i visited was the one in Hebron where Goldstein carried out his massacre, but that was on Sunday.
I did visit the church of the Nativity, but as i said, was pretty underwhelmed.
Had some interesting meetings with the likes of Sabeel and ICAHD, not to mention a very heated Q&A session with a lovely bunch of young ladies at the Midreshet Lindenbaum school.
Am doing chores and screwing around the internet
Can you hear Radio Foyle from where you are?
I am listening to it on the internet
@ RS:
Hope you enjoyed your trip mate. Elaine is a legend!
Why on earth would i want to listen to Radio Foyle?
Oh forget it.
Forget what?
Mahons
You smooth talking devil you. With respect the jewel of your post was your tribute to a good man and an example of one that we should be reminded off. That doesn't compare in any way with advancing the notion that people not going to war have no right to support or advocate it.
If I had been arround in late forties I would have been advocating like billyo. I wouldn't be joining up. Apart from anything else I would be a bit useless the theatre of war. Perhaps I could have joined the Axis side though ;o).
A NAZI advocating the invasion of Poland lends no more credibility to it just because he is champing at the bit to get into the thick of it.
Aileen - I prefer silver tongued fallen angel, but why split hairs?
The point of the comment was not that people must enlist in the armed services if they wish to advocate for a particular conflict, but more to remind those who are constanty rattling sabres and decrying the loyalty of others that their money is not where their mouths are.
Indeed she is Petr, has the patience of a saint too.
Mahons, indeed a wide range of people were killed. A couple of civilian contract medical workers as well. The thought that I could have been there is very sobering. The faces of the dead are just like the ones I see every day.
Now that the emergency has passed, my calm and collected demeanor has turned to choked back tears several times daily. It's something I'm going to have to work through I guess.
My dear Silver tongued fallen angel ;o) , but isn't that the same point? - their money not where their mouth is.
We all need to be kept aware of the cost of war and indeed to cost of not war.
Oh Danny boy
Sorry I missed your post. cheers and welcome to the bear pit :o)
RS -
I did visit the church of the Nativity, but as i said, was pretty underwhelmed.
What, they still haven't cleaned up all that Palestinian shit?
I had forgotten about that Pete. Now where are my white gloves that I'm required to wear to handle my Koran?
What, they still haven't cleaned up all that Palestinian shit?
Decent folk will be appalled by that comment from the extemist Mr. Moore.
At least you didn't disappoint guys.