Wednesday
30May2007
SHOULD PAISLEY APOLOGISE?
Wednesday, May 30, 2007 at 07:57PM Here is what the charm void Ian Paisley Jnr had to say about gay people in a recent interview.....
"I am, unsurprisingly, a straight person,” the North Antrim MLA is quoted as saying. “I am pretty repulsed by gay and lesbianism. I think it is wrong. I think that those people harm themselves and – without caring about it - harm society. That doesn’t mean to say that I hate them. I mean, I hate what they do.”
IRA/Sinn Fein - the organisation that has murdered thousands and maimed tens of thousands -has used its "Unionist Outreach" spokesperson, convicted BOMBER Martina Anderson to condemn Paisley for using words that she alleges "feed into the attitudes that fester and lead to homophobic violence.”
The Gay lobby have naturally gone into overdrive. kindred souls with the IRA on this one, seemingly.
So, is it a crime to say that one views homosexuality as wrong? If it is, should Paisley be arrested, or at least cautioned? Should the Bible be banned for advocating an anti-gay position? What say you?
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Reader Comments (35)
I don't share his views, however:
1. No, he need not apologize for expressing his view.
2. His view is clearly not a crime.
3. There should be no arrest or formal government action for an individual expressing a view.
4. I disagree that the Bible is anti-Gay, but even accepting that for the sake of argument, I don't think any book should be banned.
I don't know Ms. Anderson's history, but if that is the case you make a valid point about her protest.
I don't know why someone whose very existence reminds us that Ian Sr. actually had sexual intercourse would opine on the issue of human sexual relations other than to suggest that there is evidently someone out there for everyone. But he's entitled to his opinion.
Cheers for that Image of Big(now I get it!) Ian's nocturnal activities, Mahons. Really!
The election in the ROI has been and gone and SF can return to sh*t-stirring - with the extra incentive that they want to take attention away from their abject failure in the ROI!
I think it's disgracefull that anyone has the temerity to criticise the comments of Ian Paisley Jnr. The gay lobby and other politicians who disagree with him should shut up.
http://www.hotpress.com/politics/frontlines/2926457.html
Hot Press in action!
Colm - interesting timing for all this - I wonder would the Shinners have been so critical before the election in the ROI ?
Hmm - more harmful to society than Paisleyism? Thats debatable. Let him say what he likes - I dont suspect many gay people give a flying f*** - and Martina's in no position to jump on the moral bandwagon about anything.
The Paisleys were always good for a laugh - one might accept their admonitions for over-indulgence in the "devil's buttermilk" but they lost everyone when they condemned line-dancing
Mad
I'm not really that bothered by what Sinn Fein say,and I don't think the election in the south has any impact on what that SF woman would have said in response to Ian Jrs comments, but if he can be free (and he should) to express whatever views he wants on gay people then the 'gay lobby', Sinn Fein , and anyone else should be free to condemn him just as vociferously without being attacked as 'going into overdrive'. Had he made the same comments about Jewish people I doubt very much if David would have been so quick to defend him and attack Jewish people for responding in their own defence. .
SF are a fine crowd to cast aspersions about someones morality!
Colm - it's a manufactured story .
He was asked in an interview - should he have lied?
If he had said no comment - there would still have been a fuss.
Why should Junior be persecuted for HIS religious beliefs ?
If Martin McGuinness said in an interview that he believed abortion was a sin and repulsive to him would there be screams of outrage from Martina and Dolores ?
And I do think - despite there being something about gay rights probably tucked away inside the 80 page manifesto -that SF would NOT have kicked up a big fuss before the election - in case it would have cost them votes with devout RCs - just as they tread on eggshells about abortion.
Mad
I think what you just said has probably hit the nail on the head.
Rubbish Mad. How is he being persecuted ?. He gave his opinions on gay people and others who disagree with him have given their opinions. Had he made those comments about Black or disabled or other religous groups of people he would have had just as much if not more condemnation in return. If you can't stand the heat and all that. Why should someones views be given special protection because thay can be deemed 'religous beliefs'. Are his comments on gays more worthy than out and out racism or anti-semitism' ?
It's an important issue -
If his religious beliefs disbar Ian Jnr here, surely practising RCs should be disbarred from the health ministry because of their church views on birth control and/or abortion ? Espcially as the Vatican overtly uses blackmailto try to pressurise RC politicians.
>>in case it would have cost them votes with devout RCs <<
MR,
There aren't many of those left in the RoI. cf. bonker Bertie's repeated victories and enormous personal vote.
(strange that the 2 Ians never mention his unorthodox domestic set-up. Remember how Ian Senior called Clinton a philanderer.)
I think Paisley Jnr should be allowed think, say and do as he pleases, as should also his detractors.
Mad
Whoah ! I never said he should lose any job or post My views are what Noel has just said so well in his last sentence.
Rubbish Mad. How is he being persecuted ?.
He is being attacked Colm. The message is that he shouldn't have his job.
He was ASKED - should he have lied ?
How about RC politicians views on birth control and/or abortion?
I know it's a Paisley and they are fair game - but forget who it is, forget his father and deal with he issue. A politician has answered a question on his beliefs, beliefs informed by his religion.
Mad
Perhaps you ought to forget that his main detractors were Sinn Fein which understandably colours your response. I wonder what you would have been saying if a new RC Sinn Fein minister in the executive had said he thought protestants repulsed him and that their beliefs and lifestyle damaged themselves and society . Would you have been quickly on here defending that minister's beliefs and demanding he should not be persecuted. Sure you would, and Felix would have been on next saying he's joined the PLO !
It may have been manufactured in this particular instance, but Ian Junior doesn't seem to be holding his cards close to his chest on the issue. He mentions his distaste for homosexuals (don't go there Colm) on his own site in 2004 and apparently without prompting attacked Trimble's political judgment on the basis of an aide's homosexuality.
Again, entitled to his opinions, as are those who criticise him.
Isn't the point that Minime is responsible for distributing grant money to gay organisations? Organisations that repulse him?
mahons
You do try and provoke me ! As if I would ever dream of making tasteless(!!) jokes about this topic. I would bend over backwards to avoid such unnecessary double ententres .
>>...condemn Paisley for using words that she alleges "feed into the attitudes that fester and lead to homophobic violence.”<<
Depressing, really. An indication that blood is thicker than ... well, anything really. Forty years ago, this might well have read:
>>...condemn Paisley for using words that she alleges "feed into the attitudes that fester and lead to sectarian violence.”<<
Who knows, but in a couple of generations the Paisley family will be approaching normality.
Bearhunter - funny.
Colm: I knew you would rise to the occasion.
Bearhunter.
If he continues to do his job without breaching the rules of equality he has signed up to then fair enough , he doesn't have to like all the people he may have to support in an official capacity.
Funny how Paisley Jr had little comment on the Berry 'sports massage' issue, when it was causing a little in-house difficulty for the DUP.
Colm, that's my point. He is absolutely entitled to hold whatever views he likes as Ian Paisley Jr. However, he has to at least give the appearance of not being prejudiced against certain groups when he speaks as Ian paisley Jr MLA.You'd think that hanging around a man as politically savvy as his father would have given him some clue as to how comport himself on the political stage.
If he is sorry for what he said, then he should apologise. Elsewise what's the point?
Twenty Major has a superb blog on this
Personally I’m repulsed by politicians. I think they’re wrong. I think those people harm themselves and - without caring about it - harm society.
http://twentymajor.net/
p.s. it's also a bit, erm, rude in places!
I see Martin McGuinness has given him what-for. He rightly reminds us that those remarks were made by someone wearing his ministerial hat (or cap, he being Irish) and that's against the rules.
I'm said this before but this is a good opportunity to say it again. While I despise both the DUP and Sinn Féin, I do feel that this "coalition" assembly will work because of the two extreme elements it contains. All ministers must toe the line or risk censure from the other party -- as is happening here.
His words were harsh regarding homosexuality, he could have and should have, as an elected representative, made his views known with a lot more tact. But then again tact is one thing lacking in Northern Politics. As NI changes over the next few years, this is definitely something they will have to learn. Lose the word 'hate' when talking to the public.
So a DUP politician expresses homophobic views.
Hold the front page!
Delusional Irishman,
I agree. Tactful he wasn't!
SF can blow women and children to pieces and then come on here and without batting an eyelid state that no one can dislike the "inversion" of nature by sodomites. What kind of a crazy society do we now live in?
What is more interesting for Big Ian which David Vance et al have not picked up on yet is accorsing to the front page of www.ivanfoster.org he is for the High Jump at the Free Presbyterian Presbytery meeting tomorrow. So we will not have the conflicet between the FPC and the DUP much longer.
If the essence of Protestantism is the acceptance by the individual Christian of his direct responsibility to god rather than to the Church. Then everybody whatever their sexuality will have to give an account of themselves. Some times the authoritarianism of Free Presbyterianism is a kin to Rome s. Who (Rome) today in Scotland are pontificating on abortion. What do they want to do export the problem like the Republic?
How about some compassion for the living as well as the unborn? Numerous diocese facing bankruptcy in the USA due to child molesting clergy! The problem with holding resolute religious views is that its difficult for all the flock to live up to ! Before you can say Paul Berry youve been let down. A number of senior Unionist politicians knew far more about Kincora and what was going on there, than we have ever been told, including in my opinion one who now has a deputy called Martin.
I do really wonder if you have missed the point here, Junior has made his feelings well known before he took office, however when he did he agreed to the principles of the assembly one of which is equality.
Now if hes decided after less than a month he cant abide by this then he deserves condemnation this assembly will only work when people work together and this is a clear signal that hes not prepared to.
If a public offical stood up and said i hate black people there would be an outcry so why should this be any different?
Listen you fool, Jr is talking about the repulsive acts of sodomites which was deemed so perverse that only a few years ago we locked them up. Black people are born black - sodomites and paedophiles chose to act they way they do.
Listen you fool?
Really, Peter, not so long ago we were locking up and executing those who denied the myths propagated by religion. We do that not longer. It's called enlightenment.
I've just heard the journalist Quintin Letts telling Nolan that were a junior minister to say such a thing in Britain, he'd be sacked immediately.