Sadly these are the facts of our times, and I am afraid the times of our children.

In watching the events unfold over in Britain I can't help but wonder if any attacks are planned at the thousands of 4th of July festivities over here both this weekend and next.

Troll,

We stand together and we, and our kids, will NEVER give in.

I think it's significant that they were tackled by holidaymakers ? Way to go, Glasgow ! The rest of us need to grow a backbone too.

Orlando, I think it is signifigant taht bystanders helped take down the creeps. A bit of that British pluck!

I agree Charles - im proud of them. its also a message to the islamists out there who act like cretins and drive 4x4s into solid doors. If we send out the kind of message that signals doom then im sure they are feeling bouyed up about their clumsy crap. It ended with them on fire, on the floor, chased by everyone and in prison. The day they succeed is the day i wallow. Not before.

The latest attacks were within a hair's breadth of being successful - and lets not forget that some of the July 05 bombers were incompetent, but others succeeded spectacularly. Its legitimate to debate whether the govt have learnt anything in 2 years. I have every respect for our police and intelligence - they have a hellishly difficult job and comparisons to N.I aren't invalid as we too never knew where the next attack would come from - but it is legitimate to question the political will here. The issue at heart is the best way to deal with the threat of extremism

100% full moon here in the UK.
Coincidence?
Expect more from the 'lunatics' until it starts to wane again on Monday.

David

Great post. I agree 100%. We've been lucky this time in both London and Glasgow. If we hadn't been lucky the death toll would have been horrendous.

Troll

I'm flying to NY on Wednesday 4th July and I'm delighted to be going to your country on that day. ***k these jihadist scum and their western apologists.

Here's my suggested action plan for Gordon Brown:

1. Cut off all links with the Muslim Council of Britain and denounce them for the jew-hating extremists that they are. Their refusal to take part in world holocaust day tells you all you need to know about their real agenda.

2. Close all the jihadist-supporting mosques in Britain, starting with Regents Park. Intern or deport the jihadist mulllahs.

3. Withdraw the UK from the European Convention on Human Rights. It is hampering the anti-terrorist campaign and cannot be tolerated for a minute longer. The idea of these murderous scumbags disappearing from their house-arrest is intolerable - several of them did so a few weeks ago.

4. Ban the burka in public, including courtrooms. This may seem trivial, but it sends a message that we are a secular democracy with liberal values, both of which are incompatible with the religious suppression of women.

here here good sugestions Pete. Do you think anything along those lines will take place? and how many of your brethren would call for the same?

have a good flight...

...and the chances of Brown taking that course of action are........

Good ideas Peter - no. 1 has already started happening. If you read Pickled Politics Sunny Hundal gives good updates on this as he has been championing this for a while. This is good news at least on that score.

I think you'll find issues with 4. I agree we are a secular democracy and the only way to be even handed and send a message is to reaffirm that point completely. Islam generally has rattled cages and the government is running on empty respect of religion on all scores - so expect more groups to jump and down soon. The effect will be to ensure a secular democracy isnt forthcoming any time soon.

Peter

Banning burkas and the MCB will have not the slightest effect on the terrorist cells currently in operation. They;re irrelevant and the MCB, whatever anyone thinks of them, have called for anyone with info on the current attacks to come forward. The HR legislation which ties in with deportations of dangerous mullahs are on the agenda. Remains to be seen what will happen here

Sara - We needer firmer voices that dont put provisos on their involvement and send the wrong signals. Great to see the council of ex muslims and the funding going to more womens groups now. The government have walked away from the MCB. It needs to be unequivocal support in this fight.

This *cant* be the same Peter we normally play with...head spinning now...

DSD - Petes always made his views on religion and jihadis very clear.

Sara

The MCB are a bunch of jew-hating fanatics with a smiling public face. Alison is right about the government already cutting off contact with these scumbags. It was their refusal to participate in world holocaust day which finally caused the penny to drop. But the government needs to go much further and publicly denounce them.

DSD

Obviously you are not familiar with my posts on the subject of islamic jihad and its fellow-travellers. Secular liberals like me hate them and all they stand for.

Thanks Alison. But it's Peter, not Pete.

Can't win tonight, Al! ;)

Sorry! There is a clear difference between you and Pete of course!

Al is what my family call me. so youre off the hook, Charles. I think Pete Moore and Peter are pretty distinct so fair enough!

100% with you David. No Surrender.

I have been out since 7:30 this morning with swim team activities. I saw the news and my jaw dropped.

We stand with you 100%, David, and with all freedom loving people of the world.

Oh - and I totally agree with Peter's suggestions.

I want to make one last comment on the past 2 days fued between Alison and myself.

First of all to the ATW community I appoligize for boring you with our little spat.

2) I have been and always shall be a supporter of the British people and our friends in NI

3) we are at war and we are in it together. what happens in your country effects me and mine over here.

4) I can not and will not change who and what I am. I am blunt and firm in stating what I believe.

5) MI5 also admits as was my original point that they believe they were caught with their pants down you can read it in the Daily Mail here
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=465450&in_page_id=1770&in_a_source=

6) I will not engage with Alison any further.

To the rest of you I beg your forgiveness for allowing my blood to rise. When I see people I do care about being put in jeopardy by animals in the name of their god it upsets me. It also upsets me when I see people in both our countries not taking the threat seriously and our governments not doing everything they should be doing to keep us safe.

I appoligize to the group.

Just looking at the alert levels stated on the link to the BBC in the main text, it says that 'critical' means that "an attack is expected imminently". Well, just prior to those bomb discoveries in London, were the authorities at 'critical'? NO! (as far as I'm aware) So exactly what is that alert system for?

As for 'militant' islam being the enemy of us: it is ISLAM that is our enemy and the enemy of Hinduism, Sikhism, Confucianism, Shinto, Buddhism etc etc and has always been so. Unlike other belief systems, islam demands of its believers that they make war on kufr (that's me and most of you) so whether it be by bombs or high birth rates, islam and the moon-god worshippers intend to take over our land.

Allan@Oslo,

"islam demands of its believers that they make war on kufr (that's me and most of you)"

Really, the sooner you realise that you are Allan@Oslo, not Allah@Oslo the better.

Clearly there are hundreds of thousands of Muslim believers in this country who don't share your interpretation of Islam.

Troll - We know that we were lucky. but that debbie downer crap is NOT the first thing i would post to you guys when the US finds itself in this situation. why cant we react the way we did, with humour and a piss take? it does not mean we are not taking it seriously. Its just very British.

Not a single UK blog i read this weekend did anything other than take the piss. All of these blogs usually attack islamism on a regular basis. Good for them

Here is a thought: Think back to a month ago when we posted on ATW about the airport gas attacks and the usual mob came out and said - they were amateurs, it will never happen. Well, amateurs can be dangerous. I dont think much more needs to be added to recent events to make that point to those people now.

Equally i wont big-up islamists further when they FAIL.

You wont always win over people who are stuck in thinking this is about Iraq. Choose your battles (a lesson for me there too)

Try to understand that being proud of security, police, people doesnt mean we are not serious - but when the islamists fail, they fail. The message that sends is just as worrying to the islamists.

I can only go on what i read as can you - if you take that to mean i am not taking this seriously you are mistaken.

Next time a word of friendly support, before you start having a go, might come across better - just a thought. Bear in mind i was not alone in how i read your comments yesterday but if you choose not to comment to me then by all means - stick to your guns.

Clearly there are hundreds of thousands of Muslim believers in this country who don't share your interpretation of Islam.

No! There are hundreds of thousands of 'muslims' who don't want to be muslim and would like the law to protect them from the vengeance of believers. The usual penalty for apostasy is death and the police allow women to be murdered and any men who would wish to leave get the message.